Triangle United Way

[Brent]

OK, here's one that's not exactly politics, but some variant thereof, and it gets my goat, so I'm posting it.

The Triangle United Way kicked out the Occoneechee Council of the Boy Scouts of America as a member agency. That's their right; they get to decide their membership (although I find it ironic that they kicked out the Scouts because they didn't agree with the Scouts' membership policies).

The TUW had a rough year last year. They ignored a good deal of evidence that their fundraising was down as a direct result of their decision about the Scouts (they blamed the economy; it would appear that was only a part of the reason). The Scouts exceeded their aggressive fundraising goals by a non-trivial amount. I and many others quit giving to the UW and instead decided to give directly to the agencies of our choice.

In addition to overall lower fundraising last year (this year's results aren't in yet), the TUW also noticed that designated gifts are becoming a larger share of total giving (i.e., people give to the TUW but earmark their gifts for a specific agency).

In response, the TUW, last year and this year, has pleaded with people to give to their "undesignated" fund (or whatever they call it) so that they can allocate funds to their member agencies as they see fit.

It seems to me that the TUW would be better off admitting they made a mistake, and allowing the Scouts back in (that is, if they even want back in). It seems to me that the TUW's member agencies should be screaming at their board to let the Scouts back in, because kicking out the Scouts apparently is a pretty large factor in the pain these agencies are experiencing. Instead, everyone just pleads for people to give to the undesignated fund.

I don't like to see these agencies suffer; they do good and often critical work that no one else is doing. I gave to the UW for decades, and volunteered for several of their agencies. But they're not getting another dime of my money until they quit playing politics with their member agencies. And their member agencies, especially the smaller ones, are unfortunately the ones suffering the most...and yet those agencies seem to be unwilling to slap some sense into the TUW board, instead parroting the party line of "give more undesignated $".

To "paraphrase" that Balance guy: "Thoughts?"

[johnb]

I refuse to give the United Way ANY money anymore, not until they admit they were wrong.

On the press release they issued they flat out lied about the BSA's policy. I emailed the TUW at the time, they didn't have the guts to respond.

Frankly, I think it says a lot about the organizations that are still taking money from the TUW. If it really is a charitable organization doing good deeds, how can they ally themselves with or take cash from an organziation that sees fit to absolutely lie about the BSA not to mentionan organization that puts it's partisan politics above helping kids? The TUW is politicizing children by slamming the door on the BSA, while certain lifestyle groups want to make it a political issue the BSA keeps it all about the kids.

[TJ]

In past years, in another city, I Chaired the United Way fund
drive and have always participated but not any more. I give
my money now directly to the Boy Scouts. The United Way
caved in to political correctness and while they have every
right to do as they wish, they don't have a right to my money
to use in that effort. I urge everyone to abandon the United
Way and give your money directly to those who you feel
warrant the help.

[BobC]

Somebody please publish the Boy Scouts membership policy so we can all be on the same page. Thanks. :)

[Brent]

Somebody please publish the Boy Scouts membership policy so we can all be on the same page. Thanks. :)

I'll give it a shot, as I understand it. The US Supreme Court has affirmed the BSA's right, as a private organization, to set its own membership policies. The BSA doesn't want members who are opposed to the Scout oath and Scout law, two fundamental tenets of membership.

Among the many things that could (and in some cases, have) arisen around this principle is the one that seems to get the most attention, which is that the BSA does not believe that an avowed homosexual adult leader is an appropriate representative of the oath and law and so ought not to be a Scout leader.

[johnb]

There actually was not an explicit policy on homosexuality. It fell under the morally straight clause of the Scout Law.

That said, there were numerous things that fall under that clause. The fact that they now have to be spelled out is not a fault of the BSA, it is due to the lack of shame on the part of the individuals. There is no specific policy on adultery, polygamy, and other related issues. Adults who engage in that type of behaviour should not expect the BSA to "embrace their diversity" or whatever other nonsensical verbage the perps wish to decorate their conduct with. They should expect to be asked to leave the BSA.

The Triangle United Way engaged in a bit of cheap politics when it cut funding for the Occoneechee Council. It did so because of pressure from the Triange Community Works, a homosexual created/run non-profit. The TCW staged a media event, refusing United Way funding, to dramatize it's bitch against the BSA. They lobbied the Triangle United Way and Craig Chancellor caved.

This had/has zero to do with children. No 7 year old boy who joins Cub Scouts is a homosexual, no 11 year old who joins Boy Scouts is a homosexual. There are adults who want to politicize them and this issue which is what Chancellor fell for. He flat out lied, the TUW acted at the behest of homosexual adults who have an ax to grind with the BSA. It has NOTHING to do with the children.

Their cheap theatrics can be reviewed here:

http://www.tcworks.org/tcw/media/20010124.htm

Here is something from the TUW's own web site:

Triangle United Way's minimum standard requires member agencies to provide a board approved non-discrimination policy that ensures access to services regardless of race, color, religion, sex, disability, national origin, age, and sexual orientation.

If that is their standard, how then do the Boys and Girls Clubs get funding? Are 30 year olds allowed to join in order to get access to the gym facilities same as the kids?

The sad thing is that in this day with so many broken families, these boys need male role models. It's sad that TUW would bend to a group of extremists and take the action they did. It does, however, serve to let the general public know who is to be trusted and who is not to be trusted. Undesignated donations to the TUW are down significantly and that hurts extremists like TCW, while direct donations to the BSA are up. There is some good that has come from this.

[Cathy]

There is no specific policy on adultery, polygamy, and other related issues. Adults who engage in that type of behaviour should not expect the BSA to "embrace their diversity" or whatever other nonsensical verbage the perps wish to decorate their conduct with. They should expect to be asked to leave the BSA.

Hear! Hear! Go get 'em John!
I quit giving to United Way years ago, mostly due to their standards.
Cathy

[Brent]

For many years, I considered the UW's "overhead" to be a reasonable tradeoff for (1) being able to assist smaller agencies doing important work that otherwise wouldn't be on the radar screen; and (2) a single annual campaign, as opposed to constant requests for funds and volunteers. As I noted earlier, I served on UW agency boards and gave a good bit of my time and money to them.

No more. When they got on the politically correct bandwagon, they lost me. The BSA has the same right to determine their membership as the UW does.

And the TUW continues to refuse to admit that, apparently, much of their current woes are of their own making. The BSA is doing fine (they and a small number of selected agencies now get my $, directly), and the TUW is becoming increasingly irrelevant. But they can't/won't admit it.

[kellyc]

I have never been a big United Way fan. Any money I donate is going to go right to the causes I want them to go to. That being said I thought that the United Way had kind of lost their mind with the Boy Scouts. I cant help but think that the people who claim the need for tolerance are some of the LEAST tolerant out there.


Kelly

[Cathy]

I have never been a big United Way fan. Any money I donate is going to go right to the causes I want them to go to. That being said I thought that the United Way had kind of lost their mind with the Boy Scouts. I cant help but think that the people who claim the need for tolerance are some of the LEAST tolerant out there.


Kelly

Funny, how that seems to be the case.
Some of the most intolerant people I know are self proclaimed "liberals". I've heard some pretty alarming attitudes expressed against people who don't share their views. and if you don't agree with them, they won't give you space in their conversation to differ.

Cathy

[johnb]

Kelly,

Your statement brings to mind something I said to Don Hyatt a bit ago and perhaps something I may have mentioned here in the forum. When you encounter people who enjoy telling others what a tolerant or nice person he or she is, watch out. You've just met the meanest sonofabitch in your zip code.

john

[Wuptdo]

Hi Folks. I'm glad I found this site and these forums. I had a "letter to the editor" published in the Cary News about TUW and scouts. I must of touched a nerve at TUW because for the next few weeks, the Cary News only had pro-TUW letters published. I believe they now have hired some PR flak's to handle any negative news about TUW. Oh, just an FYI, at NCSU, the TUW campaine is about 50K short this year. I wonder why?

Don't know how to do all the fancy closing stuff yet. :?:

Smile and wave at the people.



If you try to please everybody, somebody is not going to like it
Donald Rumsfeld (77)

[Cathy]

Hi Folks. I'm glad I found this site and these forums. I had a "letter to the editor" published in the Cary News about TUW and scouts. I must of touched a nerve at TUW because for the next few weeks, the Cary News only had pro-TUW letters published. I believe they now have hired some PR flak's to handle any negative news about TUW. Oh, just an FYI, at NCSU, the TUW campaine is about 50K short this year. I wonder why?

Don't know how to do all the fancy closing stuff yet. :?:

Smile and wave at the people.



If you try to please everybody, somebody is not going to like it
Donald Rumsfeld (77)

I'm glad that you've found your way here also! Welcome!
It's been pretty slow as of late here, but every now and then it picks up. Please keep watching. I have a feeling that you will add some useful input.

Cathy

[Brent]

Greetings, wuptdo! Glad you found the site. It will be nice to have another intelligent, opinionated voice here. Good to see you (and CW, too) at the parade Saturday also.

[Wuptdo]

Brent - This is for you. It really made my day. However, I will be e-mailing the reporter and asking her if she is a Journalist or a PR flak.

http://newsobserver.com/news/triangle/story/3310553p-2953484c.html

Brent, a nice LTE, thanking the good people for their donations to other agencies and not the TUW would be great. How did the scouts do this year on the dollar issue? (We haven't had our B&G dinner yet.) I know my church saw some extra money in the coffers this year. I would do one but, I'm bogged down with skool writting assignements (conflict theory, medieval technology, and learning to do a web page with just html code). Anyway, I think this is a win for the good people!

Wuptdo B-)

[johnb]

The Triangle United Way is far more interested in appeasing vocal, numerically insignificant, leftwing extremists than they are in helping ANYONE. If what mattered to the TUW was homeless kids, puppies, illiterate crack ho's etc..etc.. they'd tell our local extremists to get bent, they're funding the BSA and get over it.

Huge numbers of people stopped giving anything to the TUW when they went on their little Jihad against the Occoneechee Council of the BSA.

[Anonymous]

Wup wrote:

“This is for you. It really made my day. However, I will be e-mailing the reporter and asking her if she is a Journalist or a PR flak… I think this is a win for the good people!”

Wup, so just what is the point of your gloat? The article in question just points out that donations are down and a number of privately funded non-profit social services organizations are having trouble serving their clients. So this is a win for whom and in what way? And anyway what does this have to do with you? It is not your money and nobody is at your door making you contribute.

On the other hand you have no reservations about feeding at the public trough and putting your hand in your neighbors’ wallets. (Wup wrote: “Thank goodness for the C-Tran; that's how my 11th grader gets to school everyday. (Next year he gets to drive.”) ). What is wrong with the regular school bus? Why not take him yourself? Why do you expect your Cary neighbors to subsidize your choices? Never expected that you would be a closet supporter of this so-called mass transit service what with all the news you bring back from the Wake County Taxpayers Association meetings. So you are busted as just another what’s in it for me Cary Republican. Oink, oink.

More from the best of Wup: “Trying to find reference to Hamlet for a Englist paper I writing -- is "The Lion King" really a down in africa version of "Hamlet?"

------------------------------------

“Idiot wind, blowing every time you move your mouth,
Blowing down the backroads headin' south.
Idiot wind, blowing every time you move your teeth,
You're an idiot, babe.
It's a wonder that you still know how to breathe.” -- Bob Dylan

[johnb]

Wup, so just what is the point of your gloat?

I'll take that softball. Because we're right, you're wrong. :) Simple, direct, to the point. The TUW decided to do for leftwing extremists what Monica did for Bill. Unfortunately, its demonstrated contempt for the community it supposedly "serves" has cut its cash flow. Most people give to one, maybe two, charities. Usually their church and one other they're interested in or otherwise connected to. The United Way's continued financial mismanagement and political extremism are going to hurt deserving and undeserving organizations that get funding through them. Sad. But, donations to other non-profits, like the Occoneechee Council of the BSA are up.

So this is a win for whom and in what way?


It's a smackdown against political extremists. You all seem to expect people to continue to hand over the cash regardless of the demands and obnoxious nature inherent in the left's political agenda. Sorry, not gonna happen. IF the TUW really cares about it's "clients" it will back down and it will apologize, after telling the extremists to get bent.

The left has politicized children and made them pawns in it's assault on the American family and traditional values. Since the TUW decided to sign on with the bad guys in this dispute, they get nothing.

[Anonymous]

John, a lot of words to say that TUW (a private sector organization) has policies that you (a private citizen) do not like and that you are not giving them any money. I have no problem with that. It is your money to give as you see fit.

My issue is not about the merits of United Way, but with the hypocritical piggies (like Wup) who want the Town of Cary in my wallet when it suits their personal agenda or when they see a way to work the system for personal benefit. The Town has the power to make all of us pay, like it or not. My observation is that Cary has a lot of grownups in name only who are willing to put aside their professed principles to get a free ride or take a cheap shot.

---------------------

“Idiot wind, blowing every time you move your mouth,
Blowing down the backroads headin' south.
Idiot wind, blowing every time you move your teeth,
You're an idiot, babe.
It's a wonder that you still know how to breathe.” -- Bob Dylan

[johnb]

My issue is not about the merits of United Way, but with the hypocritical piggies (like Wup) who want the Town of Cary in my wallet when it suits their personal agenda or when they see a way to work the system for personal benefit.

Frankly, I'd be happy to have C tran shut down, the vehicles sold, and the staff laid off. *IF* there is some need for the infirm/elderly to utilize some form of alternative transportation, contract it out. The city should not be hiring anyone to drive buses nor should it own buses.


The Town has the power to make all of us pay, like it or not. My observation is that Cary has a lot of grownups in name only who are willing to put aside their professed principles to get a free ride or take a cheap shot.

If I didn't know better, I'd swear those were my words! Throw in a "sonofab!tch" and I'd have to accuse you of plagarism.

[Brent]

Getting back to the TUW: I am not surprised that their funding is down...AGAIN. The Boy Scouts fundraising is up...AGAIN. A lot of good agencies doing good work will have to try to make do with even less...AGAIN.

All because the TUW had to be PC and dump the Scouts. I have written many agency directors and told them that THEY -- the agencies who are being hurt by the TUW board's decision -- should tell the board to reverse its decision about the Scouts. Several agreed with me. Some didn't. Until they do, though, I expect that fundraising, especially undesignated gifts, will continue to go down, and the TUW will continue to become increasingly irrelevant. And their member agencies will continue to suffer.

When they made their decision about the Scouts, I told them they wouldn't get another dime or minute of volunteer time from me (I had given plenty of both in the past). So did a whole lot of other people. And yet, they continue to ask for more $, and more undesignated $, and ignore the fact that they made their own bed and are now sleeping in it.

What a pity. And by now, it may be too late to fix the problem.

[johnb]

Hey Brent,

I tell Scouts this: you can choose your actions, you cannot choose your consequences.

If these folks think they are making some "bold" or "courageous" stand, fine. As long as they're willing to pay the costs, ie see their non profit loose significant funding, of signing up to fight with the bad guys in this dispute, fine. They loose, ethically and financially.

[Wuptdo]

Triangle United Way Executive get badly needed pay raise:

http://www.bizjournals.com/triangle/stories/2005/01/24/story1.html

Just shakin' my head!

Wuptdo B-)

[johnb]

Wup,

So fundraising in 02 and 03 was down but 04 "exceeded goals".

That is not necessarily a good thing. Where the goals changed?

I'd be curious to see what those numbers actually were. From what I have heard the TUW has been seeing the numbers on the revenue stream change to where individual contributions are less a percentage of the overall revenue stream and those individual contributors are designating their contributions in order to deprive the TUW staff the ability to politicize/abuse their donations.

[Wuptdo]

I managed to get this off their website, however, the actual "goals" no longer exist:

Campaign History

* 1995: 3 County United Ways Combined $15 Million
* 1996: Triangle United Way $17.3 Million
* 1997: $20,007,000
* 1998: $22,300,000
* 1999: $25,017,119
* 2000: $26,150,618
* 2001: $26,170,154
* 2002: $22,245,606
* 2003: $18,025,250


In 2004, it was listed as $18.37 Million Dollars, with $11.2 Million going to the Community Care Fund (political Fund). Need to work harder this year educating the public. But I have a real problem with a 14% payraise for the Boss. Believe me, in will be in one of my LTE's when the time comes.
Now thru the "rumor mill" I understand TUW has extended an olive branch back to the local Scout council.

Wuptdo B-)

[johnb]

Well, until the come clean, admit they were wrong, ditch the current policy and revert to the old policy they can kiss my rear end. I don't give them a dime. Frankly, the argument that "but then you're hurting a lot of deserving agencies and people" is nonsense. Any group that would take money from the TUW "Community Care Fund" is implicitly endorsing the TUW's political jihad against the Boy Scouts and is inherently undeserving of any support.