BOIL ALERT - TOWN OF CARY

[d4vendel]

FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE
August 18, 2006

3:30 p.m.




E. COLI DETECTED IN PART OF CARY WATER SYSTEM
Cary , NC Advised to Boil Water


CARY, NC –Results of the Town of Cary’s routine sampling and testing of its water supply has revealed the presence of E. coli on Coronado Way in the Coronado Village subdivision in central Cary, and as a precaution, “Boil Water” notices are being issued for all water customers located in the Town of Cary; this DOES NOT include Apex, Morrisville, RTP, or RDU. Officials believe that this isolated finding is likely the result of an as yet undetected illegal cross-connection or recent system work during which bacterial contamination could have entered the system. Tests from nearly 40 other sampling points taken this week throughout Cary were normal.



“One home tested positive for E. coli in the Coronado subdivision,” said Town of Cary Public Works Director Mike Bajorek .



Until further notice, people in Cary should bring tap water to a rolling boil for at least three minutes or use bottled water until further notice for the following purposes:

Drinking

Cooking

Brushing teeth

Making ice

Preparing infant formula and juices

Washing fruit, vegetables and other food items

Cleaning dishes

Contaminants in the water system such as E. coli can cause diarrhea, cramps, nausea, headaches or other symptoms. Properly boiling the water kills the harmful bacteria. Sensitive customers, such as infants, young children and customers with weakened immune systems should especially use boiled or bottled water for bathing because they may be more susceptible to harmful bacteria in the water.



“While the water is safe for showers and bathing, we are advising all residents to avoid eye, nose and mouth contact with the water, including swallowing the water,” said Bajorek.



To address the problem, Town of Cary crews are flushing the water system in Coronado Village using fire hydrants and raising chlorine levels at the water treatment plant to help with disinfection. Once this is complete, another round of testing will be conducted. Once testing results are normal, the Boil Water Notice will be discontinued.



“While we are working around the clock to restore high quality services to the affected area, we expect that the inconvenience of the situation may last through the weekend” said Bajorek.



Concerned citizens needing more information may call (919) 469-4090 to speak with a customer service representative. Also, the latest updates will be available through the Town’s Web site at www.townofcary.org and via the Town’s electronic mailing list service. A recorded message with the latest update is available at (919) 319-4500.





###



PRIMARY CONTACTS:
Mike Bajorek, Public Works Director, (919) 460-4090

April R. Little, Deputy Public Information Officer, (919) 481-5091

Susan Moran, Public Information Officer, (919) 460-4951

http://www.townofcary.org/news/news2006/boilwaternotice1.htm

[DarylB]

FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE
August 18, 2006

3:30 p.m.




E. COLI DETECTED IN PART OF CARY WATER SYSTEM
Cary , NC Advised to Boil Water


CARY, NC –Results of the Town of Cary’s routine sampling and testing of its water supply has revealed the presence of E. coli .........

PRIMARY CONTACTS:
Mike Bajorek, Public Works Director, (919) 460-4090

April R. Little, Deputy Public Information Officer, (919) 481-5091

Susan Moran, Public Information Officer, (919) 460-4951

http://www.townofcary.org/news/news2006/boilwaternotice1.htm

Great... and next I suppose we'll be getting warnings for Vibrio cholerae (ie, a cholera epidemic). It's starting to look very "third world" around here, isn't it? Pretty soon, we'll be able to just float dead bodies down the Neuse and save the land they would have used for developers...

http://212.227.92.102/img/11821/wm/pd398176.jpg

[d4vendel]

Officials believe that this isolated finding is likely the result of an as yet undetected illegal cross-connection or recent system work during which bacterial contamination could have entered the system. Tests from nearly 40 other sampling points taken this week throughout Cary were normal.


Not that any one on Cary Politics is going to overreact or anything..... :wink:

I would rather have the Town issue a boil alter for the entire system and later find that it was not needed rather than wait to see if the problem exisits outside of a small area BEFORE issuing the alert.

Of course, it is the Town of Cary, so they are going to be damned if they do, damed if they don't.

I've said it before and I'll say it again. If this area is so bleeping bad, Delta is ready when you are.

- David F.

[Wuptdo]

I bought the last couple of one gallon jugs of water at my local drug store. I was told by several folks (looking for more water) that the bottled water is gone at the Food Lion on Harrison Avenue and several other places as well. 8-O 8-O 8-O

Maybe I go over to my local Sam's Club and check out the panic buying over there.

Anyway, I can't help but think of the movie "The_Ten_Commandments."" Is someone bringing the "plague" to Cary? Has someone address the Pharaoh McAlister and his Priests; and ask to set the people of Cary, Free? Who has been addressing the Pharoah the most these days?

http://www.homevideos.com/freezeframes6/ten139.jpeg

The short version here: I hate the 10 Commandents (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u1kqqMXWEFs)

Wuptdo B-)

[d4vendel]

Update:

The Town of Cary updated the notice at 7 PM to include:

As part of the notice, all restaurants, food stands, school kitchen and lunchrooms, nursing home kitchens, meat markets, and lodging facilities in Cary have been closed by order of the N.C. Department of Environment and Natural Resources. Any restaurants with questions or concerns should call Wake County Environmental Services at (919) 868-9254.

I was glad to get the first notice while was still at work so I could hit a store in RTP for water, but did not think that the restaurants might have to close. I guess the wife and I will be doing a bit of Raleigh or Durham dining this weekend. :grin:

- David F.

[bobo]

Excerpt:


What is E. coli and where does it come from?

E. coli is a type of fecal coliform bacteria commonly found in the intestines of animals and humans. E. coli is short for Escherichia coli. The presence of E. coli in water is a strong indication of recent sewage or animal waste contamination. Sewage may contain many types of disease-causing organisms.

What are fecal coliforms?

Fecal coliforms are bacteria that are associated with human or animal wastes. They usually live in human or animal intestinal tracts, and their presence in drinking water is a strong indication of recent sewage or animal waste contamination.

How does E. coli or other fecal coliforms get in the water?

E. coli comes from human and animal wastes. During rainfalls, snow melts, or other types of precipitation, E. coli may be washed into creeks, rivers, streams, lakes, or groundwater. When these waters are used as sources of drinking water and the water is not treated or inadequately treated, E. coli may end up in drinking water.

http://www.epa.gov/safewater/ecoli.html

Excerpt from d4vendel post:


Officials believe that this isolated finding is likely the result of an as yet undetected illegal cross-connection or recent system work during which bacterial contamination could have entered the system.

Sounds like someone is playing the guessing game.

[ncary42long]

So if we come down with E-Coli we can sue theTown of Cary?? My family ate dinner at the Carolina Ale House about 7:00 pm, just when the alert to close the restaurants is posted on the Town of Cary website. We're there for an hour and a half eating and drinking, and no one in the restaurant is told to put down their forks and go home. No sign of any officials from the health department, DENR, EPA, or Homeland Security that I can tell either....

Then at 10:30 pm my daughter calls on her cell phone all in a panic! "Mom, didn't you know about the E-Coli?? I took a shower and brushed my teeth before I went out and YOU DIDN'T TELL ME I had to boil the water first!!" Do you think I have E-Coli????"

"I don't think so honey, but if we do, I'm suing the Town," I tell her.


...... oh, I feel the cramps starting now... :oops:

[dhyatt]

This is one of those could mean something, could mean nothing moments. Cary Politics (i.e. - me) tested the water in Coronado Village Pond (Maynard Pond) on May 23rd, 2005. The following is from our report at the time:


The analysis of water samples gathered from Maynard Pond show significant concentrations of E. Coli bacteria. Cary Politics attributes this to the small volume of water that is even now home to several geese. The somewhat stagnant state of the pond is felt to be a primary reason for the accumulation of goose bio-solids and the accompanying E. Coli bacteria.

The complete report can be found here: http://carypolitics.org/Maynard_Pond_Water_Test.pdf

If there is a small water main break anywhere along Coronado Way that is allowing pond water to mix with the water supply, it could certainly account for finding contamination in the city supply.

[ncary42long]

So that chicken I ate at the Ale House was actually a Goose??

:cry:

[la-dee-da]

As you may have guessed, the only thing NPR reports about this story is that the entire TOC is on a boil water alert due to E. Coli until further notice.

I must admit, sitting at a stoplight in Durham, first I was completely stunned. Then I couldn't help but laugh (sorry guys).

Glad to see that once again, CP has the real scoop. ;) Sorry to hear that everyone must boil his/her water! :cry:

As to restaurants, normally I'd pepper you with great places to eat in Durham (Magnolia Grill is constantly a Southern Living #1 pick), I'd honestly have to suggest you head for Raleigh this weekend. Students are heading back this weekend (which means the better restaurants will probably be packed with parents, parking will be scarce, etc.), and there's a triathlon going on in the area as well.

Of course, if you're an early riser (and want to watch guys and gals running around in aquablades), I'd suggest hitting the farmer's market for breakfast and then watching the triathlon. ;)

[d4vendel]

So if we come down with E-Coli we can sue theTown of Cary?? My family ate dinner at the Carolina Ale House about 7:00 pm, just when the alert to close the restaurants is posted on the Town of Cary website. We're there for an hour and a half eating and drinking, and no one in the restaurant is told to put down their forks and go home. No sign of any officials from the health department, DENR, EPA, or Homeland Security that I can tell either....


I know how you feel. We went to Remington Grill around 7 or so. I had not seen the restaurant update yet. Remington Grill did have signs up saying that the Town of Cary said that you should avoid the tap water. OK. No ice or iced tea. Soda with no ice is fine by me. (The only beer they have is in bottles. Guinness or a Black and Tan or nothing - thanks.) As we were leaving after dinner, they were putting up the "Closed due to water" signs. It was almost surreal. The last time I remember brushing my teeth with bottled water was on my last business trip to India and Pakistan. It seems strange to be doing it here in North Carolina.

- David F.

[DarylB]

This whole last couple of months makes me very glad I'm a backpacker/ourdoor enthusiast. Somehow, it seems inverted to be quite suited on my backpacking trips, with a lot of clear air, clean water from my water filter, and natural views free of noise and crowding, only to be subjected to pioneer living standards when I get done, with requirements posted for boiling water, sewage being spilled into the creek nearby, etc. Somehow, backpacking just seems to be the more civilized way to go.

Now that the malignant growth rate of the town of Cary has brought both the economy of the town and much of the local outdoor recreation industry to a grinding halt, with restaurant closings, cancelled football games, lakes shut down.... how much longer before the business community that is now losing money for the foolishness of this CTC revolts, and sends the current politicians packing. They may get by with blowing off the residents of the town for a short time, but when the entire regional economy begins to slide, and businesses begin to take a hit in the wallet, and there may be some serious investigations about to begin, and some serious housecleaning.

[Wuptdo]

I watched the interview that Mike Bajorek gave to NBC-17 news tonight. Hopefully a more detailed interview (reading this Adam) will be forthcoming. However, I was left with more questions than answers. During the interview, Mr. Bajorek indicated they had been working with the State Water Quality (DENR) people for a couple of days. HHhhhhmmmm........

1) When was the E-Coli sample first discovered?
2) Where samples taken immediately to ensure the first sample was not contaminated or this was a random occurance?
3) Where did other samples come from?
4) With some of the best bio-tech labs in the country within 10 miles of Cary, isn't there a way we can get faster results than 24 hours?
5) How well funded and how up to date is the equipment that the Cary Water used. I mean, they did raise our water rates, so where did all that money go?
6) The area the problem sample occured was some of the oldest pipes in Cary, unless they got the new pipe liners in the last few years.
7) Was there more than one sample that showed contamination?
8) Exactly how big is the water system and couldn't the affected areas just be turned off without affecting the rest of the town?
9 ) Is there a bigger problem with Public Waters that we many not know about. DarylB has a point about the growth factor. Is the TOC letting the standards "slide" to keep cost low for builders/developers? When it comes to public utilities, lowest bid should not be a factor.
10) Did TOC do the right thing in order food establishments to shut down?
11) Is Cary "following the rules" about public notification/disclosure, while other multi's ignore the "rules" and don't report these things to the public. If so, I would rather know up front than find out later there was a "problem."

Anyway, just think out loud and throwing "food for thought" up on the wall. Oh, and for dinner tonight, we had Chinese Take-out by 6 pm. I don't think any E-coli made it through my Hot & Sour Soup or the chilled Vodka. :wink:

But geez-Louise, Cary has takening some $hit this summer.

Wuptdo B-)

[DarylB]

It does seem lately that the only growth that is outpacing the construction industry in Cary, is the bacterial growth (particularly E. coli) in our lakes and streams, and now in our water supply.

http://www.scottcamazine.com/photos/EColi/images/E_coli_jpg.jpg

[d4vendel]

FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE
August 19, 2006

12:35 a.m.


http://www.townofcary.org/news/news2006/boilwaternotice1.htm


CARY’S BOIL WATER NOTICE AREA REDUCES IN SIZE
Water Supply in Western Pressure Zone Deemed Safe





CARY, NC –The Boil Water Notice issued for all of Cary has been reduced in size to no longer include Cary customers in the utility system’s western pressure zone; the Boil Water Notice remains in effect for all of the rest of the customers in Cary. Results of the Town of Cary’s routine sampling and testing of its water supply revealed the presence of E. coli on Coronado Way in the Coronado Village subdivision in central Cary on Friday, August 18, and as a precaution, “Boil Water” notices were issued for all water customers located in the Town of Cary; this DOES NOT include Apex, Morrisville, RTP, or RDU. Officials believe that this isolated finding is likely the result of an as yet undetected illegal cross-connection or recent system work during which bacterial contamination could have entered the system. Tests from nearly 40 other sampling points taken this week throughout Cary were normal.



“Because we are able to isolate this section of the water system, public health officials have deemed the water safe in the western pressure zone,” said Town of Cary Public Works Director Mike Bajorek. “Boil water notices remain in effect for the remaining parts of Cary.”



As part of the notice, all restaurants, food stands, school kitchen and lunchrooms, nursing home kitchens, meat markets, and lodging facilities in Cary have been closed by order of the N.C. Department of Environment and Natural Resources. Any restaurants with questions or concerns should call Wake County Environmental Services at (919) 868-9254.

Until further notice, people in Cary SHOULD NOT DRINK THE WATER WITHOUT BOILING IT FIRST. Also, they should bring tap water to a rolling boil for at least three minutes or use bottled water until further notice for the following purposes:

· Cooking

· Brushing teeth

· Making ice

· Preparing infant formula and juices

· Washing fruit, vegetables and other food items

· Cleaning dishes

Fecal coliform or E. coli is bacteria whose presence indicates that the water may be contaminated with human or animal waste. Microbes in this waste can cause diarrhea, cramps, nausea, headaches or other symptoms. Properly boiling the water kills the harmful bacteria. Sensitive customers, such as infants, young children and customers with weakened immune systems should especially use boiled or bottled water for bathing because they may be more susceptible to harmful bacteria in the water.



“While the water is safe for showers and bathing, we are advising all residents to avoid eye, nose and mouth contact with the water, including swallowing the water,” said Bajorek.



Affected customers are asked to share the boil water notice information with all other people who drink this water, especially those who may not have received this notice directly, such as people living in apartments, nursing homes, schools and businesses. This may be done by posting this notice in a public place or distributing copies by hand or mail.



To address the problem, Town of Cary crews are flushing the water system in Coronado Village using fire hydrants and raising chlorine levels at the water treatment plant to help with disinfection. Once this is complete, another round of testing will be conducted. Once testing results are normal, the Boil Water Notice will be discontinued.



“While we are working around the clock to restore high quality services to the affected area, we expect that the inconvenience of the situation may last through the weekend” said Bajorek.



A map of the western pressure zone is shown on the Town’s website at www.townofcary.org, along with a listing of addresses in the zone. Concerned citizens needing more information may call (919) 469-4090 to speak with a customer service representative. Also, the latest updates will be available on the Boil Water section of the Town’s Web site and via the Town’s electronic mailing list service. A recorded message with the latest update is available at (919) 319-4500.







###



PRIMARY CONTACTS:
Mike Bajorek, Public Works Director, (919) 469-4090

April R. Little, Deputy Public Information Officer, (919) 481-5091

Susan Moran, Public Information Officer, (919) 460-4951



View this link to see where the "western pressure zone" is located.
http://www.townofcary.org/depts/pwdept/wpz_1.jpg
Warning - it is not a very good map.

Edited to include link to addresses no longer on a boil alert:
http://www.townofcary.org/depts/pwdept/addresses.htm


- David F.

[d4vendel]

10) Did TOC do the right thing in order food establishments to shut down?


Good points and questions, Wup, but let's keep the facts straight. The TOC did not order the food establishments to close. That was done by the folks at the N.C. Department of Environment and Natural Resources.

As to if it was the right decision - better safe than sorry. Sorry in this case meaning :


Self-limiting effects of bacterial ingestion include abdominal cramps and diarrhea.
Hemorrhagic colitis (HC) is the acute disease caused by E-Coli. HC results in severe abdominal cramps, watery diarrhea,
and lower intestinal bleeding; with occasional vomiting and fever. In some cases, hemolytic uremic syndrome or renal
failure can occur. Although not life threatening to healthy adults, these diseases can be fatal to young children, the elderly,
and immunocompromised persons. E-Coli is transmitted through fecal-oral ingestion of the bacteria by direct ingestion (i.e.
drinking), primary contact recreation (i.e. swimming), or secondary contact (i.e. fishing).
Source: US Dept. of the Interior (http://www.usbr.gov/pmts/water/media/pdfs/TC&Ecoli.pdf#search=%22Fecal%20coliform%20effects%22)





4) With some of the best bio-tech labs in the country within 10 miles of Cary, isn't there a way we can get faster results than 24 hours?


Here is some information about testing lifted from http://bcn.boulder.co.us/basin/data/BACT/info/FColi.html

It turns out that a reliable test does take 24 hours.



There are several ways coliform bacteria are grown and measured. Methods commonly used include the most probable number (MPN) method and the membrane filter (MF) method.


In the MPN method, a "presumptive test" is performed first. A series of fermentation tubes that contain lauryl tryptose broth are inoculated with the water sample and incubated for 24 hours at 35 ° C. Fermentation tubes are arranged in 3 or more rows, with 5 or 10 tubes per row, with varying dilutions of the samples in the tubes. The fermentation tube contains an inverted tube to trap gases that are produced by the coliform bacteria. After 24 hours, the fermentation tube is examined for gas production. If there is no gas production, the samples are incubated for another 24 hours and reexamined. If gas production is observed by the end of 48 hours, the presumptive test is positive; coliform bacteria are present in the sample. A "confirmed test" is then performed to determine if fecal coliform bacteria are present. For the confirmed test, some of the content of the fermentation tube is transferred with a sterile loop to a fermentation tube containing another broth. The sample is incubated in a water bath at 44.5 ° C for 24 hours. Gas production in the fermentation tube after 24 hours is considered a positive reaction, indicating fecal coliform. Based on which dilutions showed positive for coliform and/or fecal coliform, a table of most probable numbers is used to estimate the coliform content of the sample. The results are reported as most probable number (MPN) of coliform per 100 ml (American Public Health Association, 1998).

The MF method is more rapid than the MPN method, but the results are not as reliable for samples that contain many non-coliform bacteria, high turbidity, and/or toxic substances such as metals or phenols. The water sample is filtered through a sterile membrane filter. The filter is transferred to a sterile petri dish and placed on a nutrient pad saturated with broth. The plates are inverted, placed in watertight plastic bags, and incubated in a water bath at 44.5 degrees C for 24 hours. Colonies produced by fecal coliform bacteria are blue, and are counted using a microscope or magnifying lens. The fecal coliform density is recorded as the number of organisms per 100 ml.


- David F.

[Don]

So if we come down with E-Coli we can sue theTown of Cary?? My family ate dinner at the Carolina Ale House about 7:00 pm, just when the alert to close the restaurants is posted on the Town of Cary website. We're there for an hour and a half eating and drinking, and no one in the restaurant is told to put down their forks and go home. No sign of any officials from the health department, DENR, EPA, or Homeland Security that I can tell either....

So the restaurant you were eating at decided to ignore the alert issued by the town of Cary and let everyone finish their food and drink before closing and you want to sue Cary??? Wow.

[Brent]

So many things to respond to...

Delta is ready when you are
David, I've never been a fan of the "If you don't like it here, leave" message. People might or might not have a realistic option to leave, but regardless, I'd rather have everyone working together to make the place better than just having them leave. [edited to add: although admittedly there are some people who I would gladly drive to the airport, pay their airfare to some distant place and slam and lock the door behind :-D ]

Duke vs. NCSU Rivalry?
la-dee-da, it turns out that there's a large university in Raleigh, also, and that university also has students moving in this weekend (and I wouldn't be surprised if some of the smaller universities in Raleigh are on the same schedule), so sending people to Raleigh isn't really any better (because, as you note, it's likely that the better restaurants will be packed with parents, parking will be scarce, etc.).

Maybe there was a big meeting going on at the Cardinal Club?
Everyone, I do not understand why the decision to close restaurants (etc.) lagged so far behind the boil water notice? I realize it was the state, not local, government making this decision, but why did they let so many people continue to eat in restaurants for so long?

Remember those who are worse off...
Most of us can get by OK for a weekend on boiled or bottled water. I really feel for nursing home residents (those kitchens are also shut down). That could cause some hardships. And to a perhaps lesser extent, also for people visiting from out of town, staying at hotels.

Town's communication leaves much to be desired...
Hopefully the reduced area for the boil water advisory will mitigate the problem. However, I don't understand why the town can't post a useful, readable map and can't post a proper, working, freakin' URL! As Dave notes, the map is poor (I'm very familiar with Cary and had to stare at it for awhile to even figure out the general boundaries) and the URLs in the original e-mail sent to citizens included a trailing comma, so if you click on them, they don't work, and I wonder how many people will know to remove the comma.

Ha, ha, Brent, this proves how useful those signs will be...
Finally, I've already had multiple people ask me if our wonderful dynamic message signs could have helped here and why they didn't. First, they're still in test mode, so they can display only the inane static messages ("Welcome to Cary, Home of the Double Standards and E. Coli"). Moreover, even when they are fully functional, they can display only traffic-related messages (with a couple of exceptions, such as Amber Alerts). So unless the mad rush to buy bottled water caused a major traffic jam, the signs would just sit there, mute about the boil water advisory. But beware of politicians who might try to tell you otherwise ("See! This is a perfect example of why we need these signs!"). Some of our politiicans already are happily telling citizens outright lies.


-----------------------
I am really interested in what they will find as the source of this problem. In the meantime, I agree with Dave, better safe than sorry.

[Lurkie]

New Dynamic Message sign on Kildaire Farm Road has a BOIL WATER message (flashing)and phone number of Public Works. No traffic information. Just thought you all would want to know.

[d4vendel]

Delta is ready when you are
David, I've never been a fan of the "If you don't like it here, leave" message. People might or might not have a realistic option to leave, but regardless, I'd rather have everyone working together to make the place better than just having them leave

Everyone working together constructively - I absolutely agree.

What can I bi&*h, moan, and complain about now - complete with graphics? I don’t think that fits in the constructive category.


Just my 2 cents.

- David F.

[ncary42long]

So the restaurant you were eating at decided to ignore the alert issued by the town of Cary and let everyone finish their food and drink before closing and you want to sue Cary??? Wow.[/quote]

If the establishments were not notified by the Town in a timely manner and someone gets E-Coli from the water, absolutely yes.

And by the way, Brent has a good point. Why weren't the Town's signs used to alert the public about E-Coli and boiling water? Not everyone has access to a computer or CP. The Mayor could have used it as a PR bonanza "See, we are putting these signs to good use!"

[Cathy]

David,

I'm glad to see you are 'coming around' a bit from the "overblown" worries to a "better safe than sorry" position.
The impact of this "problem" is no small thing.
The economic impact of this on the business' closed might be enough to sink a few restaurants, let alone the potential health problems.



As to if it was the right decision - better safe than sorry. Sorry in this case meaning :


E-Coli is transmitted through fecal-oral ingestion of the bacteria by direct ingestion (i.e.
drinking), primary contact recreation (i.e. swimming), or secondary contact (i.e. fishing).

- David F.

In the "better safe than sorry" category, and in light of what this DENR warning has to say, I do not see how it would be safe to even shower in water that is contaminated.

Many chemicals and contaminates present in water become airborne and/or are absorbed through the skin. I would also think that one would have carefully check oneself for any cuts or scrapes before heading into that shower.
If people are lead to believe that a shower is safe, how many would mistakenly assume that it is also safe to take a tub bath or bathe their children in the tub as usual?

DonH,

Thanks for bringing up the Coronado Village pond test results.
I also remembered that the pond had high e coli levels and thought that as old as the area water lines have to be that an undetected break in the line would be susceptible to contaimaination from that pond muck.

I hope that this will also make people aware of how the aging water & sewer infrastructure of the downtown area is going to need a significant investment in upgrades before it will support the increased densities that the Town Center Area Plan is promoting.

And I wonder if any of our new neighbors on Medfield Rd., that are hooked up to Cary infrastructure have approached any of the older residents for some non-governmental water relief?

Cathy

[Wuptdo]

News stories that are written on the fly (Duke LaCross is a great example) sometimes are a little off but.........


The Public Works Department learned of the E. coli and fecal coliform bacteria at noon Friday after results came back from samples taken on Coronado Way in Cary's Coronado Village subdivision, said Mike Bajorek, the department's director.


The Wake County Environmental Services department -- which didn't know about the contamination until Friday evening -- passed on orders from the state to close restaurants in the town of 106,000 just as patrons began streaming in for Friday night dinners.

Questions arose about the town's decision to notify the news media at 4:30 p.m. Friday to disseminate the information without first contacting county health officials, residents of the affected subdivision or area restaurants.

Andre Pierce, Wake County's environmental health director, learned of the presence of E. coli in the town's water supply at 5 p.m., after news media were contacted via an e-mailed news release. Pierce told his state supervisors, who ordered Cary restaurants to close within the hour as a health precaution.

"We should have been notified earlier," he said. Bajorek agreed that someone should have informed Wake County health officials about the contamination.

I expect a more detailed story on Sunday or Monday. However, once again, it wasn't so much the "problem" itself as it was poor/inept way that is was communicated to the public and to other public officials. I don't expect the Town Engineer to be an expert on addressing the public, but at this time appears to be doing a good job in handling the problem. The TOC spends big money on having a PR Flak, but once again, the public relations aspect of this situtation was handled at best, poorly.

Wuptdo B-)

[Brent]

New Dynamic Message sign on Kildaire Farm Road has a BOIL WATER message (flashing)and phone number of Public Works. No traffic information. Just thought you all would want to know.

Fascinating! The director of engineering told us that only traffic messages would be allowed. Maybe it's because the signs aren't on-line yet that this message is permitted. Maybe it's because Cary isn't usually constrained by following the state's rules anyway.

Or maybe it's because the town council decided they could flash this message to help stem the tide of criticism.

Nah, couldn't be...political opportunism never decides things in Cary. :roll:

[Brent]

The Mayor could have used it as a PR bonanza "See, we are putting these signs to good use!"

Per Lurkie's post, apparently he did, albeit a bit late.

I've inquired as to the apparent contradiction between what we heard last week and what we're seeing this week. [Edited to add: if this sort of information can actually be displayed by the signs in the future, once they're online, then that's the first evidence I've seen yet that they have any value. If, on the other hand, they really won't be able to display such messages in the future and the town is deliberately misleading citizens by displaying such messages now to mute criticism of the signs, then they should tell us so]

[Brent]

The TOC spends big money on having a PR Flak, but once again, the public relations aspect of this situtation was handled at best, poorly.

You're right, Wup, news stories written on the fly often are questionable, but if any of these are true or even close, then:

This is beyond public relations. This is emergency communication.

Why did it take several hours to notify, well...anyone at all? (media, county officials, anyone)?

Why did stakeholder government officials have to learn about this from the media?

Why weren't affected residents notified immediately?

And most of all, WHY DIDN'T CARY LEARN ITS LESSON ABOUT USING ONLY E-MAIL TO NOTIFY PEOPLE ABOUT URGENT MATTERS from the recent sewage spill episode? ("Um...we e-mailed the media").

I'm with Wup. I seriously doubt the communications problems come from engineering.

Arrrrrgggggggghhhhhhh!

[dhyatt]

The Mayor could have used it as a PR bonanza "See, we are putting these signs to good use!"

Per Lurkie's post, apparently he did, albeit a bit late.

I've inquired as to the apparent contradiction between what we heard last week and what we're seeing this week. [Edited to add: if this sort of information can actually be displayed by the signs in the future, once they're online, then that's the first evidence I've seen yet that they have any value. If, on the other hand, they really won't be able to display such messages in the future and the town is deliberately misleading citizens by displaying such messages now to mute criticism of the signs, then they should tell us so]

Brent, you're so naive. McSignster had a flunky on the engineering staff deliberately contaminate the water so the signs could be put to "good" use thus totally undermining your CAUSE. Don't you think it's a bit strange that contanimation problems starting showing up the EXACT day you acquired your protest permit. I expect to see a request for even more signs - justified by this weeks events - at the next council meeting.


Of course my wife says that putting a "boil water" alert on the signs is probably allowed since in essence it's a warning that "traffic" at local restaraunts will be "much lighter" than normal. ;-)

[Wuptdo]

Brent wrote:

This is beyond public relations. This is emergency communication.

Why did it take several hours to notify, well...anyone at all? (media, county officials, anyone)?

Why did stakeholder government officials have to learn about this from the media?

Why weren't affected residents notified immediately?

Brent - I was still waiting for the water to boil, so I could make coffee. I was trying to be polite, since at this time, not all the facts were in (or really still in). Anyway, I know a Communication Professor or two (they also teach Public Relations) at NCSU, that will once again, have some fun at the expense of Cary's "Communication Department." Nothing is more fun than taking a Public Relations class and having your "town" used as bad examples of what not to do during a PR event.

Bottom line. Ms. Moran is way over her head and has been for years. I don't care if she knows where all the other "bodies are buried," it is time for her to either step down or Mr. Coleman to make an executive decision (Like Mr. Ford is doing this weekend).

AdminH - ROFL - good points!

Wuptdo B-)

[la-dee-da]

4) With some of the best bio-tech labs in the country within 10 miles of Cary, isn't there a way we can get faster results than 24 hours?
Depends on what you're testing for. You may be interested to know that you can almost instantly test for gram negative (E. Coli) bacteria. There are kits available (just google it- I'm sure Carolina Biological....or Amazon.com....or somebody sells them for general use) that turn red if E. Coli is present and purple if not, nearly instantly.

Often, a full water analysis will lead to more helpful results, and those do take longer. If you simply do a dipstick test for E. Coli, you're going to have no idea if your water had goose poop in it, or if there's a serious problem.

ETA: Here's a link to where you can get a test kit; you want the coliform bacteria test kit ($9.99):

Linky (http://www.watersafetestkits.com/html/drinkingkits.asp?gclid=CPq8sZ6r7IYCFRJxFQodpl1xGA)

I don't know how well *this* kit works, better ones are a couple hundred bucks and require a microscope.


Duke vs. NCSU Rivalry?
la-dee-da, it turns out that there's a large university in Raleigh, also, and that university also has students moving in this weekend (and I wouldn't be surprised if some of the smaller universities in Raleigh are on the same schedule), so sending people to Raleigh isn't really any better (because, as you note, it's likely that the better restaurants will be packed with parents, parking will be scarce, etc.).

Alas, where there is no loyalty, there is no rivalry (at least where I'm concerned :wink: ).

In Durham, most of the interesting, unique, really great (non-chain) places are right around Duke. Having lived an eaten around NCSU, I can promise that unless you want food poisoning from Ten-Ten's Grand Chinese Buffet, you're probably better off avoiding that particular area in general.

There are plenty of other great places to eat in Durham that aren't around Duke, but they get to the point where they're so far from Cary, I'd be hard pressed not to tell you to head for Raleigh- where the move-in crowd can be more easily avoided. ;)

Last night, we actually drove all the way to Char-Grill (in Raleigh) for the Triangle's Best Burgers (according to the Durham Spectator). Ah, talk about a greasy trip down memory lane. :lol:

[d4vendel]

Cathy said:
I'm glad to see you are 'coming around' a bit from the "overblown" worries to a "better safe than sorry" position.
The impact of this "problem" is no small thing.
The economic impact of this on the business' closed might be enough to sink a few restaurants, let alone the potential health problems.



Just so we are clear, I NEVER put this in the overblown category. I talk all matters of public health quite seriously. That is why I have tried to keep the "official" information as up to date as I can on this thread. This is a serious situation that requires all of the citizens' attention.

That being said, when some of our fellow posters see the next step as "we'll be able to just float dead bodies down the Neuse and save the land they would have used for developers", I do call that an overreaction and sensationalist claptrap.

Let's get through this alert first. There will be plenty of time to point fingers and lay blame after things are back to normal.

- David F.

[NewHillBilly]

Friday night me and the young'uns ate at one of them fancy Italian restaurants near Preston corners AT 9 PM.... AND LIVED!!! (Although the risotto was to die for)
Then today I spied one of them newfangled dynomite signs on Hiway 55 with a message flashing BUCKLE UP FOR SAFETY - IT'S THE LAW (Shouldn't that be "BOIL UP FOR SAFETY"?)

[Brent]

Brent, you're so naive. McSignster had a flunky on the engineering staff deliberately contaminate the water so the signs could be put to "good" use thus totally undermining your CAUSE. Don't you think it's a bit strange that contanimation problems starting showing up the EXACT day you acquired your protest permit. I expect to see a request for even more signs - justified by this weeks events - at the next council meeting.


Of course my wife says that putting a "boil water" alert on the signs is probably allowed since in essence it's a warning that "traffic" at local restaraunts will be "much lighter" than normal. ;-)

Well, dhyatt, I'm not much into conspiracy theories, but I do want to know why the town's director of engineering said one thing, very clearly, repeatedly, and then a week later, that turned out to not be the case at all.

And I have inquired as to who, specifically, decided to put the "boil water" advisory on the signs. Actually a good use of the signs! It's just that we were previously told that that is specifically not allowed.

Not that anyone on the town council is a political opportunist or anything...

And Mrs. dhyatt is very clever. But we already knew that, right?

[Brent]

Friday night me and the young'uns ate at one of them fancy Italian restaurants near Preston corners AT 9 PM.... AND LIVED!!! (Although the risotto was to die for)
Then today I spied one of them newfangled dynomite signs on Hiway 55 with a message flashing BUCKLE UP FOR SAFETY - IT'S THE LAW (Shouldn't that be "BOIL UP FOR SAFETY"?)

NewHillBilly, thank heavens you are still with us!!!

Welcome to E. ColiCary...Home of the Double Standards...Boil up for Safety...It is the Law, but not for Us...This Lipstick Makes This Pig Look Better, No?

[DarylB]

The ironic part about the "boil water alert" on the DMS signs is that, unless you already knew all the details, you'd probably be thinking the stork had arrived, and it was time to "boil water", or at least that's what the guy's job always was in the old movies....

[Brent]

The main theme of today's N&O article seems to be the significant economic loss to restaurants in Cary. There's no new information on the problem itself, but there are some specifics on the impact to restaurants that were forced to close.

Not surprisingly, most restaurants do a BIG portion of their business on the weekends. I guess I didn't really understand the magnitude of the economic impact of this until I read today's story.

I wonder if someone will calculate and publish an estimated total dollar loss from this?

[d4vendel]

FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE
August 20, 2006

8 a.m.





BOIL WATER NOTICE CONTINUES


CARY, NC –Overnight results from tests of tap water taken from throughout Cary indicate that total coliform remains present in one home in Cary, but the contamination has not spread into the rest of the Town of Cary’s water system. To address this situation, Cary crews have disconnected the house at 107 Coronado Way from the water system. The Town will be consulting with the Public Water Supply branch of the N.C. Department of Environment and Natural Resources this morning on next steps while water quality tests are ongoing. Until further notice, everyone in Cary who is not in the Western Pressure Zone must continue to abide by the Boil Water Notice.

People in Cary outside of the Western Pressure Zone SHOULD NOT DRINK THE WATER WITHOUT BOILING IT FIRST. Also, they should bring tap water to a rolling boil for at least three minutes or use bottled water until further notice for the following purposes:

· Cooking

· Brushing teeth

· Making ice

· Preparing infant formula and juices

· Washing fruit, vegetables and other food items

· Cleaning dishes



Affected customers are asked to share the boil water notice information with all other people who drink this water, especially those who may not have received this notice directly, such as people living in apartments, nursing homes, schools and businesses. This may be done by posting this notice in a public place or distributing copies by hand or mail.



As part of the Notice, all restaurants, food stands, school kitchen and lunchrooms, nursing home kitchens, meat markets, and lodging facilities in Cary outside of the Western Pressure Zone have been closed by order of the N.C. Department of Environment and Natural Resources.



Fecal coliform or E. coli is bacteria whose presence indicates that the water may be contaminated with human or animal waste. Microbes in this waste can cause diarrhea, cramps, nausea, headaches or other symptoms. Properly boiling the water kills the harmful bacteria. Sensitive customers, such as infants, young children and customers with weakened immune systems should especially use boiled or bottled water for bathing because they may be more susceptible to harmful bacteria in the water.



To determine if you are a Western Pressure Zone customer, see the map of the zone or read the listing of addresses in the zone. In addition to the Western Pressure Zone, the Town of Cary’s Boil Water Notice does not include Apex, Morrisville, RTP, or RDU.



Concerned citizens needing more information may call (919) 469-4090 to speak with a customer service representative. Also, the latest updates will be available on the Boil Water section of the Town’s Web site and via the Town’s electronic mailing list service. A recorded message with the latest update is available at (919) 319-4500.



Any restaurants with questions or concerns should call Wake County Environmental Services at (919) 868-9254.



The next update will be issued around 3 p.m. today unless changing conditions warrant earlier action.



###



PRIMARY CONTACTS:
Susan Moran, Public Information Officer, (919) 393-4383 (pager)

[bobo]

I've heard several possible explanations for the ongoing E. Coli problem in Cary, but I've yet to hear anything concrete. Is there any possibility that Cary's recent sewage spills could be the cause? Is it somehow possible for contaminted soil, raw sewage, or contaminated ground water to seep into the water system? I've not seen anything to mention a possible connection, and perhaps one doesn't exist, but thought I'd ask. :?

[d4vendel]

FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE
August 20, 2006

3 p.m.





BOIL WATER NOTICE UPDATE


CARY, NC – There has been no change regarding the boil water notice in Cary since the last update at 8 a.m. today. The next update will be issued about 9 p.m. today unless changing conditions warrant earlier action.





###



PRIMARY CONTACTS:
Susan Moran, Public Information Officer, (919) 393-4383 (pager)

[d4vendel]

I've heard several possible explanations for the ongoing E. Coli problem in Cary, but I've yet to hear anything concrete. Is there any possibility that Cary's recent sewage spills could be the cause? Is it somehow possible for contaminted soil, raw sewage, or contaminated ground water to seep into the water system? I've not seen anything to mention a possible connection, and perhaps one doesn't exist, but thought I'd ask. :?

Unless we had a spill at 107 Coronado Way, I would have to say probably not in this particular case. Let's keep in mind that the contamination has only been observed at this one house.

- David

[d4vendel]

The main theme of today's N&O article seems to be the significant economic loss to restaurants in Cary. There's no new information on the problem itself, but there are some specifics on the impact to restaurants that were forced to close.

Not surprisingly, most restaurants do a BIG portion of their business on the weekends. I guess I didn't really understand the magnitude of the economic impact of this until I read today's story.

I wonder if someone will calculate and publish an estimated total dollar loss from this?

I agree that this is a big hit for our local restaurants. I found it very interesting in reading the article that we had some owners wanting to know who was going to compensate them for their loses while others are taking the "these things happen" position. I guess some people would sue God for snow storms and ice storms if they had the chance.

- David F.

[Brent]

I guess some people would sue God for snow storms and ice storms if they had the chance.

That reminds me of a joke in which God threatened to sue Satan. Satan replied, "HA! Where are YOU going to get a lawyer?" :-D

(apologies to lawyer friends...)

[d4vendel]

The ban has been lifted.


FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE
August 20, 2006

6 p.m.









CARY BOIL WATER NOTICE CANCELED FOR ALL EXCEPT CORONADO WAY



CARY, NC – After a meeting with staff from the Public Water Supply section of the N.C. Department of Environment and Natural Resources and Wake County Environmental Services today and given that a second round of tests showed that bacterial contamination has not spread from Coronado Way to the rest of Cary’s water system, the Town of Cary has lifted the boil water notice for everyone except for the 12 customers who live on Coronado Way. Given that sampling tests confirm that the water quality problem did not spread throughout the system, only 99 customers surrounding Coronado Way will need to flush their home or business water systems before using tap water, and Town crews are going door-to-door this afternoon delivering flushing instructions to them. Today’s announcement also means that commercial kitchens and regulated establishments, including restaurants, may reopen.



“By hydraulically isolating the source area of the problem –Coronado Way –we can now say with confidence that Cary’s water is safe,” said Town of Cary Public Works Director Mike Bajorek. “We know that this has been a tremendous inconvenience to our citizens as well as an economic challenge for many of our businesses, and we appreciate their support and cooperation as we’ve worked hard to keep folks safe.”



Bajorek reiterated that only those 99 customers in and around Coronado Way that received the hand-delivered notices from the Town need to flush their water systems before using them.



While the investigation remains ongoing, officials believe that an unpermitted plumbing renovation on Coronado Way is the likely source of the water quality problem.



“As we have said from the beginning, it was critical to public safety that we act in an abundance of caution by issuing a town-wide Boil Water Notice until we were certain that our community’s health was not in jeopardy,” added Bajorek.



The next update will be at about noon on Monday, August 21, unless changing conditions warrant earlier action.





###



PRIMARY CONTACTS:
Susan Moran, Public Information Officer, (919) 393-4383 (pager)



I have to admit that I learned this coming back from Raleigh and seeing this on the Harrison Aveneue DMS.

- David F.

[DarylB]

That being said, when some of our fellow posters see the next step as "we'll be able to just float dead bodies down the Neuse and save the land they would have used for developers", I do call that an overreaction and sensationalist claptrap.
- David F.

...and would you have said that dumping 9 million gallons of raw sewage into Swift creek was "claptrap", before they actually did it? Very few people are even following the after affects of that spill.... all they know is that the Public Information Officer told them that no fsh were killed, and they can go back to life as normal. Nothing could be further from the truth. Again this weekend, Falls Lake was closed to swimming due to high bacterial counts. Bacteria grow on detritus and nutrient levels in the water, something that is now an ONGOING problem. In one of the recent warnings, there was an additional note that you should boil water, even if filtered. That's getting a little scarier to those of us who know microbiology, as the filtration devices will eliminate all the common bacteria. Viruses on the other hand are smaller than the filtration ranges of the equipment, requiring additional techniques.


Filter physically removes particles, protozoa and bacteria down to 0.3 microns in size, including Giardia, salmonella, cryptosporidium and others
Glass-fiber element is pleated for increased surface area to handle silt and muddy water
Activated-carbon core adsorbs chemicals and pesticides to improve taste of water
Pre-filter at hose inlet filters to 150 microns, removing larger contaminants before they reach the main filter to increase its life span

Normal size range of E. coli: 15-50 microns. Usual range, 20-25 microns.

[d4vendel]

No Daryl - I would not say the potential for a large sewage spill is claptrap. I would not have said that before we had the spill. Lots of sewage + man-made pipe + lots of rain can, and, as we have seen, sometimes does lead to cataclysmic spills. To say otherwise is silly. Likely and possible do not mean the same thing.

Does that in any way mean your jumping from ONE house testing positive for fecal coliform and the Town / County taking the prudent step of issuing the proper alerts for the safety of the public health to your posting of "dead bodies floating down the Neuse" isn’t, in my book, sensationalistic claptop? You bet it is.

Your massive leap in cause and effect when we don’t even know the source of the contamination or how it got into the water supply for this house is, in my opinion, absurd.

- David F.

[DarylB]

No Daryl - I would not say the potential for a large sewage spill is claptrap. I would not have said that before we had the spill. Lots of sewage + man-made pipe + lots of rain can, and, as we have seen, sometimes does lead to cataclysmic spills. To say otherwise is silly. Likely and possible do not mean the same thing.

Does that in any way mean your jumping from ONE house testing positive for fecal coliform and the Town / County taking the prudent step of issuing the proper alerts for the safety of the public health to your posting of "dead bodies floating down the Neuse" isn’t, in my book, sensationalistic claptop? You bet it is.

Your massive leap in cause and effect when we don’t even know the source of the contamination or how it got into the water supply for this house is, in my opinion, absurd.

- David F.

Granted, that bodies floating down the Neuse is a little "Dharma-esque". What is not a little "Dharma-esque" is an outbreak of disease due to contamination of the water supply, (or worse), possibly as an intentional act (ie if it's possible for one house to be the source of the present shutdown, what would be the outcome if a terrorist organization decided to spend time, talent, and treasure to kill on a large scale, as they are known to do). Beyond what could speculatively happen, we have the recent past, in which our own leaders are actively doing with our tax dollars what al Quaeda could only do with years of schemes, plotting, planning and training. If a foreign group bent on our destruction were to contaminate our water supply, bacterially infect our lakes and streams, and make them unusable to us, wouldn't we be outraged and animated in our response? So isn't it deserving that we have that same feeling toward those who are endangering our health now? Is the fact that they sit in chairs at the head of legal bodies established for us and by us any reason not to be outraged? These people are out to hurt us, whether that be by design or by their greed and intimate association with developers, and apparent lack of intellect.

[d4vendel]

"Dharma-esque" - that's the word I was looking for! :wink:


So isn't it deserving that we have that same feeling toward those who are endangering our health now? Is the fact that they sit in chairs at the head of legal bodies established for us and by us any reason not to be outraged?

Depending on what the cause of the contamination turns out to be, you may or may not have a point about the TOC council and staff.

Let's wait and see what caused this before we start assigning blame. At this point in time, we don't know if anyone in local government or staff have any culpability in this incident. This could be nothing more than a citizen’s irrigation system not having the proper backflow values installed and getting animal poop sucked back into their water line. My point is that there are any number of possible scenarios that could cause this that do not involve anyone on the Town staff of local officials being negligent of anything. Maybe they are. Maybe they aren’t. We simply don’t know and I see no purpose served by starting to make accusations and point fingers in the total absence of facts. I am not going to be outraged about anything until I know what I am supposed to be upset about. My doctor tells me I'll live longer that way.

What we do know is that we have staff that found the contamination in the course of normal testing and sounded the alarm BEFORE people starting showing up at the hospital. I’m going to count that as a good thing.

- David F.

[d4vendel]

Update from the WRAL website:


Although the investigation remains ongoing, officials believe an unpermitted plumbing renovation on Coronado Way was the likely source of the problem, officials said.

http://www.wral.com/news/9704783/detail.html

Kind of hard to hold the Mayor responsible for that......

- David F.

[Brent]

I have to admit that I learned this coming back from Raleigh and seeing this on the Harrison Aveneue DMS.

As previously noted, this is the only useful application I've seen for these signs yet. Previously, we were told that such messages wouldn't be allowed. Maybe they changed their minds?

[Rono]

I think the signs should read

ENJOY CARY!

BUT DON'T DRINK THE WATER!!!

[d4vendel]

Previously, we were told that such messages wouldn't be allowed. Maybe they changed their minds?




Brent, I think that this statement is incorrect. What we were told is that the was a limited number of uses that that the DOT said the signs could be used for. In addition to traffic messages and Amber Alerts, I am certain that PSAs dealing with a potential health crisis have always been and will always be an approved use. Things like "Money Mag says we're #5" would not, and should not be.

- David F.

[Brent]

Previously, we were told that such messages wouldn't be allowed. Maybe they changed their minds?




Brent, I think that this statement is incorrect. What we were told is that the was a limited number of uses that that the DOT said the signs could be used for. In addition to traffic messages and Amber Alerts, I am certain that PSAs dealing with a potential health crisis have always been and will always be an approved use. Things like "Money Mag says we're #5" would not, and should not be.

- David F.

The council meeting minutes state:


Mr. Bailey stated the Town has an agreement with DOT to indicate what is permitted on these signs, and it must be related to driver information. He stated within these parameters, the Town can display custom driver information messages.

However, I also recall that Mr. Bailey noted other specific potential uses, including Amber Alerts, and the staff report does indicate "Messages regarding public health and safety may be displayed for specific cases". I agree that the "boil water" message fits this latter category and was useful (albeit late and only supplementary to other means of communication). I believe that council requested more specificity on the types of messages that could be displayed.

The staff report also notes that "On the other hand, displaying information not germane to real-time traffic conditions may erode the credibility of DMS and reduce their effectiveness as a traffic management tool".

[DarylB]

A couple of points here.

One, there has been a lot of talk about distractions to drivers, with the emphasis on cell phones being somewhat popular among the group whom I can only call "controlling". Yet it is principally this same group that wants to put messages in front of us, of their choosing of course. I'd sooner have my cellphone, and get a live "driver update", if the high tech route is what we're going to use. In Germany, they had a system for interrupting your radio/tape/CD with voice traffic announcements, which you could select to receive or opt out at your choosing. And this was live back in the '80's. Are we so far behind in 2006 as to require these "message boards"? Traffic.com already provides for FREE real-time cell phone, PDA, and in-box alerts, as well as an interactive map capability that makes these DMS signs arachaic and irrelevant monstrosities to our lack of technical savvy. So much for the image of an avant garde community!

http://www.traffic.com/offerings.html?utm_source=overture&utm_medium=sem

Two, when we have multiple warnings, advisories, and interests, how are these going to be sorted out and "editorialized" when they start flashing messages at us? Who's going to be running the "multi-media show"? If there's an accident at Kildaire Farm, and traffic is backed up on Holly Springs rd, and the water is foul, and there's a fire on Academy street, and..... you get the feeling the front page of the N&O might be a great read BEFORE going to work, not while you're driving. I for one don't want to be diving into the glove box looking for a pencil to write down that phone number to call when the guy ahead stops suddenly. So what good is the number if you can't write it down?

Each driver has about 5 seconds of contact with the sign. How much and how relevant is the information that the driver gets from this snippet of info? Sort of reminds me of "Crimson Tide", where they're waiting for the rest of the EAM, ready to nuke Russia because they only got the launch message, but the never get the abort message.... and so it is with all those cars headed toward yet another traffic jam, unaware the sign (now behind them) is now warning of total gridlock where they've just been redirected, a problem generated from all the diverted traffic, and the route they (and everyone else) opted out of that is now clear sailing. If it was my guess, i'd probably be second guessing the recommendation. hmmmm.... gee, that really helped!

I asked a simple question in a previous post, and NOONE has opted to answer it. If we've spent moiney to install 80 miles of fiber optic cable, and we've place cameras for surveillance, and all the rest of this traffic monitoring system has gone up to ensure that all lights are green for as far as the eye can see, then why do we need these message boards? Unless the traffic management system still leaves us ensnarled, and we have to have these messages to provide the breadcrumbs to find our way out of the traffic maze after all these expensive and complex systems fail us, they're not going to be of much use? And if we find that many uses for them from traffic that is still clogged, it will only a testament to the failure of the remainder of the traffic control system expense. Either way, they are just not very helpful.

[dhyatt]

The low down on the E-Coli contamination seems to be that an illegal temporary hook-up to a house under repair on Coronado way led to the problem. Details are few since the law may have been broken but among other things the hook-up didn't adhere to the town's ordinance requiring a backflow prevention device. The relevant ordinance is here:

Sec. 36-78. Cross connection control, backflow prevention assemblies required, program established. (http://www.townofcary.org/depts/pwdept/crossconnectioncontrol/ordinance.pdf#search=%22test%20water%20throughout% 20town%22)

[d4vendel]

So, do the restaurant owners sue the homeowner or the plumbing contractor? :wink:

(Just kidding, people.....)

- David F.

[dhyatt]

So, do the restaurant owners sue the homeowner or the plumbing contractor? :wink:

(Just kidding, people.....)

- David F.

It's also worth noting that routine testing (the town does 10 random water tests a day throughout town) found the problem. That's somewhat fortunate in this situation since the longer the problem exists, the more likely it is for someone to get sick.

[DarylB]

So, do the restaurant owners sue the homeowner or the plumbing contractor? :wink:

(Just kidding, people.....)

- David F.

Keep in mind that the career of John Edwards was foisted upon the nation from Medfield Estates, right here in Cary.. there's a trial lawyer here under most every rock the developers can dig up, my friend... and no, I'm NOT kidding!

[Brent]

So, do the restaurant owners sue the homeowner or the plumbing contractor? :wink:

(Just kidding, people.....)

And THIS is why we we really miss having a plumber on the town council!

(also just kidding, people! :-D ).

[Brent]

I wonder if someone will calculate and publish an estimated total dollar loss from this?

It turns out that someone (N&O) has:

http://www.newsobserver.com/102/story/477790.html

6 million bucks. Wow. And the article notes "Insurance won't cover most of the missed sales, forcing restaurant owners to absorb the losses."

Wow.