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Thread: Sign, sign everywhere a sign except at Carpenter Farm Supply

  1. #101
    Brent's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by WEP
    I watched the meeting last night (specifically to see the sign "debate") and was thoroughly embarassed to be a Cary citizen. I'm a Cary native and have seen some stupid things from our council before but this collection of people is, far and away, the least qualified bunch I've ever seen assembled and they should fire half of whoever "staff" is (you know, the people who keep coming up with idiotic recommendations).
    WEP, you're right on.

    You ought to send a synopsis of this post to both the town council and to the local newspapers as a letter to the editor.

    Quote Originally Posted by WEP
    However, one thing was missing from the discussion. No one asked what the total cost of running this system will be. One excuse for not wanting to abandon these signs was that we would have wasted $500,000 on them, but how long (in years) will it take to recoup that money if the project is killed (as it should be)?
    Excellent point.

    Moreover, this need not be a complete loss of the capital funds. The signs probably could be re-sold to Holly Springs or Las Vegas or some other place that wouldn't mind getting a bargain on some.

    Quote Originally Posted by WEP
    I have also been dealing with "staff" lately on a couple of issues and I've never met people who care less about the citizens of this town (I won't be specific because I am still trying to remedy the situations but I was talking to a secretary about one of the problems and the person in charge overheard us and quickly closed their door so I couldn't adress it with them directly...pathetic).
    It's more than pathetic. Town employees are supposed to put citizens first and, for the most part, drop everything else when a citizen calls or visits. This person and this person's boss should perhaps be reminded of this.
    - Brent Miller

    "The job of a citizen is to keep his mouth open" -- Gunter Grass

  2. #102
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    Default Asleep at the wheel........

    While no doubt Council and Staff are once again enjoying a good laugh at our expense with signs, I wonder why they went "ugly" in the first place. I spent a little time this morning looking over web sites that had various electronic traffic signs -- all of them butt ugly. So from that viewpoint, they didn't have much selection to choose from. However from my several years of metal manufactoring, I have learned that nothing is impossible with a little time, creativity, and money.

    Now don't get me wrong, I don't like these signs at all, but the idea of pissing away $12 million dollars doesn't sit too well with me at all. Now the idea of "slapping some paint on those pigs" might be Raleigh's solution to improving their low-income housing, but this is Cary, and we are supposed to be/do better. (OT - Now would be a good time for me to say "I told you so" about re-electing the "status quo," ie., the last council meeting). My 2 cents for an idea:

    1) $10,000 Reward for the best student design from NC States "School of Design" (Money & work stay local, and it gives a young person a break);
    2) Design a metal "frame" (recommend Stainless Steel) to fit around and attach to current signs;
    3) With approved plans & specs, bid the job out to the various "local" metal fab shops (include install as well)
    4) Install and hope it is an improvement
    5) Remember this come next election season!!!!

    Sort of what I had in mind:
    http://www.electrictime.com/i/p/PSTC...stallation.jpg

    http://www.electrictime.com/i/p/PSTC...stallation.jpg

    I want Cary to be the "City on the Hill" however it seems to me that between Cary's CoC, CTC, Staff, and the Mayor, we are becoming the "City in the Sewer."

    Wuptdo
    “I’ve seen things you people wouldn’t believe.
    Attack ships on fire off the shoulder of Orion.
    I watched C-beams glitter in the dark near the Tannhauser gate.
    All those moments, lost in time, like tears in rain.

  3. #103

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    According to staff the signs are $45,000 a piece. The 12million was for the entire system once its put in place. They know good and well its not too late to dump this whole thing but it would make them look very bad in the process so there is no way in hell they dump them.

  4. #104
    DarylB Guest

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    Quote Originally Posted by WEP
    According to staff the signs are $45,000 a piece. The 12million was for the entire system once its put in place. They know good and well its not too late to dump this whole thing but it would make them look very bad in the process so there is no way in hell they dump them.
    They think they look bad now, I think I know a few folks that will make them sorry they even thought about anything to do with a sign, and that's just before breakfast... I'm locked and loaded for this one!


  5. #105
    DarylB Guest

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    Quote Originally Posted by DarylB
    I wonder if David Letterman would be interested in doing a "Top Ten Reasons not to Decorate a Sign in Cary, NC" bit, especially after seeing the "artwork"?

  6. #106
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    Quote Originally Posted by WEP
    According to staff the signs are $45,000 a piece. The 12million was for the entire system once its put in place. They know good and well its not too late to dump this whole thing but it would make them look very bad in the process so there is no way in hell they dump them.
    Correct. The entire system cost $12 million. These signs cost about $500,000. That's an average of about $45,000 apiece, although that's not the precise per-sign price because there's one giant one that spans 1/64 that costs a lot more than the other pole signs.

    I guess we're supposed to feel better because "only" half a million of our tax dollars were wasted. Gee, thanks, town council! :P

    And WEP, you got it precisely and entirely right. As usual, they are letting politics get in the way of doing what's right.

    I watched the council meeting tape. Nels was entirely right. He is the only one who is listening and responding correctly. The others should stop talking and listen, but no, they continue with the convoluted rationalizations, pathetic excuses and preposterous assertions. Supplemented, in this case, by a couple of people, with some outright lies.

    So, they don't want to look bad by acceding to citizen demands and tearing down the signs. Do they have any idea how bad they -- and Cary in general -- look by continuing this charade?

    Oh, well, they've made their bed and now they can sleep in it. Daryl's got some excellent ideas. And I'm just getting started. We're in for a long ride, and the usual politiican tactics won't work this time.

    I'm locked and loaded also.
    - Brent Miller

    "The job of a citizen is to keep his mouth open" -- Gunter Grass

  7. #107
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    Wup, that's probably what ought to have been done in the first place, but apparently staff snuck around and found these particularly ugly signs, which look absolutely nothing like the one slide that staff claims to have shown council several years ago when council approved the overall system that included the signs buried in the plan.

    But at this point, the only sensible thing to do is to tear down the signs. Aesthetics is only one of several concerns with the signs. Attempts to fix the aesthetics after the fact will throw good money after bad and really do entail putting lipstick on a pig (undoubtedly your ideas of involving designers and local manufacturers would product much better solutions than the ones proposed by government, but it's still more money). And it won't truly fix the aesthetics, and it certainly won't solve the problems with cost, uselessness and arrogant government hypocrisy.

    And when the signs are torn down, we could sell them to Holly Springs or Las Vegas to recoup some of the cost. We need not lose the entire half million dollar investment. And that's still better than throwing MORE tax money at the problem and incurring the ongoing operating costs.

    Moreover, several council members seem to be opposed to spending money to tear down the signs...but they suggest spending money not only to put the lipstick on the pigs but also to move a bunch of the signs around to places that they deem "better". I'll bet that moving 2 or 3 signs costs as much as tearing down all of them.

    Of course, when you're dealing with convoluted rationalizations, pathetic excuses and preposterous assertions (and now, even outright lies!), there's no need to let logic get in the way.

    Kudos to Nels for a refreshing blast of truth injection into town hall. Shame on the rest of them. No wonder Steven Colbert put them on notice!
    - Brent Miller

    "The job of a citizen is to keep his mouth open" -- Gunter Grass

  8. #108
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    Default Yep.....

    I seem to recall that Cary pays much higher salaries to ensure that we have the very best "staff" as possible. Even getting payraises, when most folks in the "real" world got none (you IBM'ers know what I'm talking about). Also, I would be curious which consulting firm they used to come up the primarily plan; i.e., they go on the "do not use" list.

    Is also supposed to coordinate the traffic lights as well, so that traffic will flow through Cary better?

    Brent wrote:
    And it won't truly fix the aesthetics, and it certainly won't solve the problems with cost, uselessness and arrogant government hypocrisy.

    Of course, when you're dealing with convoluted rationalizations, pathetic excuses and preposterous assertions (and now, even outright lies!), there's no need to let logic get in the way.
    A good example of why we should have council seats reduced to two-years terms (keep Mayor for four years) and change town managers and senior staff every five-seven years. Seems to me that too many people have gotten comfortable in the new leather chairs and fancy work place. It is like the local government is taking it's que's from federal and state government.

    Just remember folks, they are trying to sneak the pool palace through right now!

    Wuptdo
    “I’ve seen things you people wouldn’t believe.
    Attack ships on fire off the shoulder of Orion.
    I watched C-beams glitter in the dark near the Tannhauser gate.
    All those moments, lost in time, like tears in rain.

  9. #109

    Default Who got paid to put up those signs?

    I'd like someone to research who owns the company who erected the signs. Someone in our goverment got paid to set up the whole idea to begin with, I'd like to know more.

    Did we just not hear we didn't have the money to upgrade our water systems. Yet, we spend $550,000 on these nasty signs. They are band-aids to our traffic issues. Why not improve roads, and bring back impact fees to help pay for the structure needed for growth.

    Are Mayor is pro-growth! Yes, and at what cost. The elected officials are giving away what made Cary a great place to live.

    Vote Em' OUT OF OFFICE!

  10. #110
    DarylB Guest

    Default Re: Who got paid to put up those signs?

    Quote Originally Posted by Mel
    I'd like someone to research who owns the company who erected the signs. Someone in our goverment got paid to set up the whole idea to begin with, I'd like to know more.

    Did we just not hear we didn't have the money to upgrade our water systems. Yet, we spend $550,000 on these nasty signs. They are band-aids to our traffic issues. Why not improve roads, and bring back impact fees to help pay for the structure needed for growth.

    Are Mayor is pro-growth! Yes, and at what cost. The elected officials are giving away what made Cary a great place to live.

    Vote Em' OUT OF OFFICE!
    I suspect the PORK industry!


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